Council of the Nations and Regions

Question

15:17:00

Asked by

To ask His Majesty’s Government how they intend to report to Parliament on the work of the Council of the Nations and Regions.

The inaugural Council of the Nations and Regions met on 11 October in Edinburgh to discuss growth and investment. On 17 October, the UK Government published the terms of reference for the council and a communiqué summarising the discussion. A communiqué will be published following each meeting of the council.

I thank the Minister for that excellent Answer. However, does she agree that while the council has got off to an excellent start bringing the nations and regions of the United Kingdom together, it is a pity that large areas of England were not represented. What are the Government going to do to make sure that they are represented at future meetings of the council?

The Deputy Prime Minister chaired the first leaders’ council on 24 October, where she vowed to forge a new relationship based on honesty and respect between central and local government, helping drive economic growth and improving lives. The leaders’ council brought together Ministers and local leaders to tackle shared problems. The Deputy Prime Minister has also written to all areas with a devolution deal to invite them to come forward with a proposal. New mayors established through this deal will be eligible to attend the Council of the Nations and Regions.

My Lords, this council appears to have rendered obsolete the Prime Minister and Heads of Devolved Governments Council. Does the Minister really feel that is an appropriate sign of respect to send to the First Ministers of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland?

I assure the noble Baroness that that is not the case. Before the first full meeting on 11 October of the Council of the Nations and Regions—which, to remind the House, was a manifesto commitment—the Deputy First Minister of Northern Ireland and the First Ministers of all devolved Governments had a multilateral meeting with the Prime Minister, which would fulfil tier 1 of the IGR requirements. With the greatest respect to noble Lords opposite, that was the first time such a meeting had happened since 2022.

My Lords, as a former Minister for Yorkshire and the Humber and a strong supporter of regional development agencies, which the previous Government made a big mistake in abolishing, I welcome the establishment of the Council of the Nations and Regions. Can my noble friend the Minister assure me that she will encourage mayors and combined authorities to draw up strategies for the whole of each region, such as Yorkshire and the Humber, to complement their individual strategies?

I thank my noble friend for her support. The Deputy Prime Minister is fully committed to empowering mayors and combined authorities, and we are working with local leaders from across England to deliver the most ambitious programme of devolution that this country has ever seen. We want to see all partners collaborating regionally, which obviously includes Yorkshire and the Humber. Our upcoming English devolution White Paper will be published in due course and will set out details.

My Lords, one of the objectives of the council is to identify “barriers that can be unblocked”. Does the Minister accept the belief of the Welsh Government—which was raised by the First Minister of Wales, the noble Baroness, Lady Morgan of Ely—that the Barnett formula in its present form is a barrier to effective provision of public services in Wales? Will she confirm that the council has triggered an investigation into this matter? If not, why not?

My Lords, the Council of the Nations and Regions is one vehicle where the Heads of Government meet, but we have regular conversations with all First Ministers, especially the First Minister of Wales. That is why we announced the largest-ever Budget settlement for Wales under devolution, including a £1.4 billion increase because of the Barnett formula. How it is spent is now a matter for the Welsh Government.

My Lords, I welcome the formation of the Council of the Nations and Regions and, particularly, the forum it provides for the Prime Minister to meet the First Ministers of the devolved nations and the mayors of combined authorities. I was pleased to read the brief minutes of the first meeting on the government website. The Labour manifesto committed to set out a new memorandum of understanding outlining how the nations would work together to strengthen the Sewel convention. Has that been done? If not, what progress has been made on it?

I thank the noble Baroness for her question. Work is under way. This is about how devolution works, and therefore there will not be one person who announces that. We are working with each devolved authority to make sure that any changes and updates to the MoU on the Sewel convention work for all devolved Governments and will report in due course.

My Lords, can the Minister assure the House that the council’s activities do not duplicate existing structures or initiatives, particularly in relation to devolution agreements and inter- governmental relations? Is clear value for money therefore provided by the council for taxpayers across the United Kingdom?

My Lords, I think it is fair to suggest that, for the last 14 years, there have been challenges in conversations between devolved Governments and mayors and the Government. That has not benefited economic growth in any corner of our country. This is to fix that and is therefore value for money. On the substantive question of where the Council of the Nations and Regions fits into intergovernmental relations and bodies that already exist, all those bodies exist because of conversations that have happened with the devolved Governments, so we are working with them to make sure that this structure, and future structures, will work for them to deliver for the people of every corner of our country.

My Lords, given that the UK Government have recognised the distinctive identity of the Cornish through the Council of Europe’s Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities, can the Minister say whether there are any plans to recognise that identity within the Council of the Nations and Regions, irrespective of whether they vote for a mayor? I note that the Cornish do not take kindly to being called English.

That threw me, my Lords. I am assured that they will be recognised through their combined authority and will be able to attend future meetings. I will come back to the right reverend Prelate on the other points.

My Lords, for the last decade, the relationship between the UK Government and Edinburgh has not been—how can I put it?—the healthiest. In what way can the Council of the Nations and Regions ensure that those relationships are healthier and more productive in the next decade, not least for the people of Scotland, who have lost out because of that fractiousness between the two Governments?

That is at the nub of the creation of the Council of the Nations and Regions. It is about making sure that we deliver for every corner of the country, that we do not just reset but normalise relationships between the UK Government and the devolved assemblies. What we saw on 11 October at the first meeting of the Council of the Nations and Regions was a meeting bringing everyone to Edinburgh to have those conversations and to talk about what priorities should be before the investment summit that occurred in the following days. That delivers real investment. We heard a great deal from the previous Government about levelling up. This is about levelling up in action and making sure that we are prioritising every corner and not just those that shout loudest.

Notwithstanding that the Government gave more money to Wales in the Budget, is not the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, right that the Barnett formula, which is deeply unfair to Wales, needs to be looked at finally for the future, rather than brushed off and pushed behind a carpet?

My Lords, we have no current plans to review the Barnett formula.

My Lords, will my noble friend confirm that this Government are committed to a comprehensive plan for devolution in England, and that this plan will, for the first time, allow proper powers and proper money from the Treasury to be devolved to the authorities that are closest to the people and able to solve the problems?

My Lords, there will be an English devolution Bill, and I thank my noble friend for the work that he has done for decades on devolution. The White Paper is soon to be published. We are expanding devolution, devolving further powers to local leaders to drive economic growth and empower communities. It is a responsibility of this Government to make sure that we deliver for every corner of the country.